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SilentKO
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri  Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 1:35 am |
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Joined: Sat May 05, 2012 9:14 pm
Posts: 101
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Fabian wrote: Yuri was incredibly hard to build. I don't think we can change the way his jetpack works. Maybe it would be easier if he couldn't walk and he just flies around. But then he wouldn't be able to fall, which is crucial for countering him. He gets very overpowered when he can't fall and we tried the hold-x-to-fly which basically breaks your thumb if you want to quickly do some skills and fly at the same moment during combat. In any case, Yuri is in his own league and you need a different mindset to play with him. It helps if you think of him of as an annoying little monkey throwing poo from the sky and try to play like that. oh and we've buffed his timebubble in the patch  Honestly i think he was find the way he was but like you said you need use him with a diff mind set and most ppl think he can go head to head with other heroes but he cant thats not his roll and thats the reason why most dont know how to use him cuz they are always running by them self or think they can get away with flying around the map without protection. He is a support Hero if you are playing as him you are suppose to always follow one of ur team-mates not the other way around Specially if you are playing online with random ppl.
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Lanofrose
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 2:44 am |
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Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 8:41 am
Posts: 8
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Fabian wrote: Yuri was incredibly hard to build. I don't think we can change the way his jetpack works. Maybe it would be easier if he couldn't walk and he just flies around. But then he wouldn't be able to fall, which is crucial for countering him. He gets very overpowered when he can't fall and we tried the hold-x-to-fly which basically breaks your thumb if you want to quickly do some skills and fly at the same moment during combat. In any case, Yuri is in his own league and you need a different mindset to play with him. It helps if you think of him of as an annoying little monkey throwing poo from the sky and try to play like that. oh and we've buffed his timebubble in the patch This is a start to see if it helps him more, but now that I think about it a Yuri that can't be knocked down can fly out of range above the rest all game......and that would be broke against not just Leon. maybe not one hit knocks him down but like 3 hits will but not stun him stopping his laser or something like it does now were you have to leave the air just to fight a Leon killing the point of flying if it puts you at a disadvantage like that.
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digitallimit
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 6:59 pm |
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Joined: Sat May 05, 2012 2:00 pm
Posts: 100
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Fabian, I think he just needs to be able to jump. Tap to jump, hold to jump+activate flying. You get the responsive feeling of jumping right on button press, and you also can seamlessly transition into flying. If you're in the air, tapping will activate and deactivate flying, just like before. Simple as that!
Of course, that's a large re-haul on gameplay, so I don't expect the change. But it'd definitely make Yuri more fun to play as given you won't have those frustrating can't-jump-away moments.
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Fabian
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 7:56 pm |
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Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 7:06 pm
Posts: 502
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digitallimit wrote: Tap to jump, hold to jump+activate flying. This is how Yuri worked a while ago, but again, looks great on paper, doesn't work in testing. What happened, a lot was people were frantically pressing the jump/fly button to get out of the action (for instance when attacked by leon), turning the jetpack off again in most cases and obviously this is very frustrating, because it actually does the opposite of what you want. We changed it to a single press, which still feels a bit slow, but it's way easier to manage.
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digitallimit
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 8:27 pm |
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Joined: Sat May 05, 2012 2:00 pm
Posts: 100
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Huh, guess you gotta cater to the gut reaction.
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Treppin
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 8:39 pm |
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Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 2:40 pm
Posts: 63
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Maybe, if you haven't tried already make it held activation with RT or R2. Since these are unmapped.
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Nintendude92
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:17 pm |
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Joined: Tue May 08, 2012 10:48 pm
Posts: 217
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Honestly if you reduce or take away the ability to knock yuri out of the sky, Yuri would just get back up far too quickly and frequently. The keep away game he can play on the two maps with open ended skies is crazy and his slow upgrade on the beam and nest of bombs he can place makes it hard at times for Leon to commit to a kill on him provided you haven't lost many turrets.
With enough health you are just fine as Yuri, because you are NOT supposed to be within range of Leon to fight you 1v1, that is what Leon is supposed to be punishing you for. Low health and generally lazy positioning. Yuri discourages me when I play Leon when he is constantly dropping bombs and has his slow laser up. But during team confrontations I will go straight for him.
I do think that once Leon has him down though that Yuri has very little chance at escaping naturally, but with all the trampolines and juking in this game, I think he is fine with a health pickup or two.
I would not be against him getting a knock back of some sort to get people off of him, but hard escapes is asking for too much if you really just look at his kit. The guy can fly.
The only time I think it is a little too hard for Yuri is early game where Leon can backstab and harrass him without many worries, but this is a team game
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Elvick
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 1:02 am |
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 7:41 am
Posts: 192
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Fabian wrote: digitallimit wrote: Tap to jump, hold to jump+activate flying. This is how Yuri worked a while ago, but again, looks great on paper, doesn't work in testing. What happened, a lot was people were frantically pressing the jump/fly button to get out of the action (for instance when attacked by leon), turning the jetpack off again in most cases and obviously this is very frustrating, because it actually does the opposite of what you want. We changed it to a single press, which still feels a bit slow, but it's way easier to manage.
Because that is exactly how Yuri plays against Leon (and those situations). You frantically press 'x/a' when he hits you because you know you're going to be screwed if you get knocked ALL the way down. But he keeps attacking, of course. So you then have to continue to mash and press up and hope that your mashing and their attack mashing will be timed in a magical way to let you get the upper hand and escape.
Yeah good luck with that Yuri. Just drift down and accept death. He'll just tongue you back anyway. Your only real chance in these situations, is just out right kill your attacker(s). Which forces you to focus on mines and your laser's damage.
It's extremely difficult to see yourself right when it falls, and it's hard to time it properly against Leon especially. You want to KEEP flying, but you know that you're going to push the same button that is used to turn it OFF... You're already at a point where you're frantic about staying in the air, add to that the fear of death (since death has value to the other team in these games) and the fear of accidentally turning it off yourself... and it's a mess.
I can't imagine that testing for how it is now worked any better. Holding the button (or using L2/R2 (LT/RT) wouldn't be easier to fly. And when someone uses a move that knocks you down, it shuts off temporarily. Then you KEEP HOLDING and it automatically turns on within a certain time. (whatever works)
So to fly, you hold a button. To STAY flying, you keep holding a button. It's much easier that way. To push a button to fly and stop flying is all find and dandy... until you have to STAY flying. :/
I'm fine with Yuri being knocked down, but his recovery from that suuucks. It needs to be different, or Yuri needs something else to help him in these situations instead of outright killing people. Like a push away laser upgrade or something. Functioning like Voltar's push, maybe less frequent and only on 'full power'.
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Syd
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 7:21 pm |
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Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 9:28 am
Posts: 47
Location: Right Behind You... Or maybe in front
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The other day I stuck solely to playing Yuri just to see how really difficult escaping anything can be.
Maybe it's because I have quick reflexes, but unless I was ganged up on it was pretty easy. I feel a little bad because the whole time I was laughing jubilantly and commenting on how easy it is to get away from things.
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Woyldman
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Post subject: Re: Leon is OP against Yuri Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 8:43 pm |
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Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 11:29 pm
Posts: 163
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Just put lots of mines near you if are for some reason in a near to reach place for Leon, so that he has to run into at least 2 bombs. When they explode and you see a XX damage pop up, activate time warp instantly and fly up. Quite a lot of the time you can kill him whilst he jumps up and tries to slash at you, as he won't expect it. Dropping mines when he tries to jump up and slash you is also a great counter.
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