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 Post subject: Re: some yuri changes from an actual yuri player
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:21 am 
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Slevens wrote:
What is your opinion on getting good and having map awareness to not get killed by jumppad mines? Is it healthy for the game?

I disagree that it's just that (even if that was InstapantsMan's main point and you're simply replying to that). Lower league strats revolving around Yuri minestacks are not just limited to stacking on a jumppad. Combining it with characters such as Ix, Smiles, Skolldir or Leon leads to people getting one-clicked into a giant pile of mines which isn't very fun at all for new players and takes 1/10th the gamesense it takes for the opponent to play around, as little as that is in practice. I'm not saying these strategies are overpowered but they're very braindead and pray on people just trying to learn the game at their own pace. It's a lot harder for a new player to avoid the dance of death that is dodging every single stunpunch, every single Ix bond, every single Smiles hook etc. while contributing to the match as it is to think "well I'll just avoid the jumppad lol" which seems to be all people make it out to be.

I get these strats aren't a problem in comp or L2/1 but I think we should be at least a little considerate for the new player experience when removing minestacking intelligently will have little impact on Yuri's power level in proper skilled games. Theoretically if minestacking were somehow just deleted from the game without altering anything else then we'd still be able to spread Mines intelligently or facebomb for meaty damage which is most of what Mines are good for in proper games. The main issue is having a good method to fix it without impacting these other parts which is where the DoT change controversy comes in (starts negatively affecting facemines if done poorly).

On top of all that I'm sick of garbage players autolocking Leon after I pick Yuri and demanding I sit in one spot stacking and ignoring teamfights/map control just so the Leon can camp them for easy picks. Not that I comply most of the time but then it usually leads to the Leon picker flat-out sucking at Leon as they were banking on the combo the whole time. Not a serious point just a funny personal issue I've noticed in solo Q lol.

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 Post subject: Re: some yuri changes from an actual yuri player
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:57 am 
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InstapantsMan wrote:
What is your opinion on having the ability to oneshot with jumppad area denial? Do you think it is healthy for the game?

I dont think its a problem at all because once you die from it you can learn from your experience and try to counter it next time you see yuri doing it. Most of the characters have a way of pressuring yuri out of his position and there is a good chance you can just straight up kill him when he is camping bounce pads. Also when he is doing that he is not doing much else which means its virtualy a 2v3.

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 Post subject: Re: some yuri changes from an actual yuri player
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 12:18 pm 
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FishmanDerp wrote:
snip


While I see your point, the issue with mines in lower leagues is indeed mine stacking. But if you limit it to 2 mines max (toaster timer changed to 3rd mine) and keep the damage buff then it should be fine. I get that what I said could be "considered toxic" but I mean come on. There's an obvious work around that even some Yuri players are supportive of yet Yuri needs the Titanium Spike buffs because his damage is horrendous past 20 minutes unless you're running laser.

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 Post subject: Re: some yuri changes from an actual yuri player
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 12:31 pm 
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Slevens wrote:
While I see your point, the issue with mines in lower leagues is indeed mine stacking. But if you limit it to 2 mines max (toaster timer changed to 3rd mine) and keep the damage buff then it should be fine. I get that what I said could be "considered toxic" but I mean come on. There's an obvious work around that even some Yuri players are supportive of yet Yuri needs the Titanium Spike buffs because his damage is horrendous past 20 minutes unless you're running laser.

I feel like a 2 mine cap will not reliably fix the issue. It will tone the noob combo damage down by a pretty good margin but I think 2 mines is plenty to get the free KO. Meanwhile it also renders Toaster Timer a meme item yet if Toaster Timer raises the cap like suggested then we're back at square one with minestack combos.

I wasn't saying what you said was toxic by the way, I just disagree on the problem being purely a jumppad gamesense one.

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