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 Post subject: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 9:31 pm 
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easiest way to greatly buff him mostly with tools he already has by making them more available to the players, instead of forcing them to spend tons of money into pigeonholed playstyles which are mutually exclusive.

you shouldn't be forced to play Siege only but you shouldn't have no power whatsoever while mobile if you choose to.
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AA row:
- base damage increased to 9 (~14.5 dps, cats max out at ~44 dps, siege damage unchanged).
1: Bat Catsuit: +3 cats damage, +2 siege bullets damage. 3 stages, 200 solar.
2: CAT Package: 1 stage removed, only applies to cats. cost reduced to 140 solar.
3: Sweet Syrup Bullets: 20% slow, 0.5 sec duration. 1 stage, 160 solar.
4: Split Personality Cat: piercing cats, 45% damage after piercing, range halved after piercing. 1 stage, 190 solar.
5: Solid Fist Missiles unchanged (or buffed if deemed too weak, possibilities are limitless!), only applies to siege mode. 175 solar.
6: Longcat: 1 stage removed, only applies to cats. cost increased to 160 solar.

changes mostly based off of Ted's design, you have one main upgrade with most of the damage on it, but then you can specifically upgrade either one of your autoattacks.
i have seen the other guys' suggestions of making ALL upgrades apply to both autoattacks but i don't believe that way they can be fairly priced, cause they'd still be 2 upgrades in 1, making it either crazy cost-effective or crazy solar dumps.
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Grid Trap:
- now standalone row.
- arming time reduced to 0.3.
1: Empowered Grid unchanged.
2: Strengthened Trap unchanged.
3: Lead Casing: duration halved. 1 stage, 160 solar.
4: new upgrade: 10 DoT damage over 5 seconds. 2 stages, 150 solar.
5: new upgrade: pull after trap is placed. 2/3s the radius Nibbs' orb has. 1 stage, 140 solar.
6: new upgrade: spawn teamcoloured health pack after succesfully trapping an enemy. +20 health. price - 160 solar.

addresses some of the issues. you can react more with Traps, you have some upgrades supplementing either of mobile or tactical playstyles and also option for sustain that gives the enemy the means to deny you your healthpack.
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Siege/Nuke:
- now standalone row.
- now can control the Nuke with movement keys while in Siege-mode.
1: Force Field unchanged.
2: Deployment Pads unchanged.
3: Hydrocollision Lava Lamp unchanged.
4: Super Powered Nuke unchanged.
5: Combustion Lava Lamp: explosion size +1.5. 160 solar.
6: Brim Force Field: 1 flat damage shield. 2 stages, 130 solar.

more control over nuke, upgrades that affect Siege Mode and Nuke share the row to not make you play differently if you're doing Siege, but give you more options if you're not.
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- +5 (+50) base hp.

nearly not tanky enough for how slow his horizontal and vertical movement speeds are, seeing as how other tanks get plenty of sustain and/or speed/movement to go with their tanky design.
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overall you can then go from here to address his further terrible matchups when he is more playable than he is now.

lemme know whatcha think.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 10:58 pm 
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i concur, it's about time to give some love to mr zork. i like your suggestions, except increasing his base hp. with reduced time on arming traps and more flexibility, i think that would be a tad too much.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 11:51 pm 
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I am not a fan of fusing cats and siege together as it removes the synergy entirely and instead throws away that ideal entirely, instead we should embrace Derpl's denial gameplay and give him love in a less static way. I myself hade a post awhile back about this that I would like to add here to give a differing opinion on the matter and show my reasons for disagreeing so heavily.

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=39808&p=551343&hilit=Derpl+Rework#p551343

Also I do have to mention that Gridtrap as a singular upgrade would not lead to a very healthy game as it would just lead to upgrades where you spam it with no downsides.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 1:12 am 
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I think I figured out to balance derpl's dps while maintaining balance and diversity on each rows. How about putting nuke damage and siege damage into 1 upgrade since I generally dislike how his siege damage is split up entirely into different rows as an attempt to balance his damage. Personally think it should be 4 tiers of +120 nuke damage and 14 turret damage. Maxing nuke at 930 and turret damage at 156.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 1:15 am 
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frankie3 wrote:
I think I figured out to balance derpl's dps while maintaining balance and diversity on each rows. How about putting nuke damage and siege damage into 1 upgrade since I generally dislike how his siege damage is split up entirely into different rows as an attempt to balance his damage. Personally think it should be 4 tiers of +120 nuke damage and 14 turret damage. Maxing nuke at 930 and turret damage at 156.

I think the problem with that idea is then the upgrade would have to be solar balanced around its duo effectiveness. I know that is why you split it into two upgrade but I cannot see it as a idea that is worth implementing.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 11:40 am 
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Derpls siege and aa should be in same row

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 7:16 pm 
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Spacemanspiffy wrote:
I am not a fan of fusing cats and siege together as it removes the synergy entirely

you build Siege with my rework same way you did until now, only you don't get screwed by a latejoin Rae when you suddenly need cats dps more or want to do some actual turret damage.

pls elaborate else i don't see the logic behind your statement.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 7:26 pm 
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I've always been for combining them, a la Ted.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:21 pm 
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Xelrog wrote:
I've always been for combining them, a la Ted.

I've tried it, trust me I've tried it, and it just doesn't work.
The main issue you run into is that the number of upgrades exceeds the maximum number of upgrades you can have in 1 row. To make matters worse, separating nuke and snare upgrades over 2 rows means that you're left with a lot of empty space without many options to create new, competitive upgrades as they are very linear skills, more linear than Raelynn's snipe infact. To put it in short, merging the rows results in 1.5 upgrade rows required for AA, 0.5 upgrade rows for Nuke and 0.5 upgrade rows for Grid Trap.

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 Post subject: Re: Derpl rework for 2.12 pls
 Post Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:24 pm 
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We only have to combine turretfire damage onto the cats row. That leaves two options: Either Siege shares its row with Nuke and we have to come up with some new Snare ideas, or Siege keeps its own row and we just have to come up with one or two new upgrades for it.

I don't think the skills are any more or less linear than Airstrike and Stimpack, really.

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Last edited by Xelrog on Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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