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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 7:03 am 
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robochase6000 wrote:
i like playing characters that have interesting AA mechanics that require a fair amount of nuance and skill to maximize. Doubly so if they have interesting jumping mechanics.

I dislike characters where i can turn my brain off and tape down the AA button.

Voltar's AA is already heavily dependent on either timing the charge shot (CFED) or positioning yourself to hit both of the targets you want (usually your allies or an ally and a primary target).

If you think removing the range-power dynamic would remove the only thing Voltar's AA has going for it you're playing with too many sedentary comps.

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I'd still like to see his AA should be even more exaggerated into a binary hi/lo power based on range. Right now it's mushy af. i think i'm in the minority here though :shady:

Considering this would have the problem of causing his AA output to swing violently based on his relative positioning, this would only exacerbate the problems the current iteration already has.

Most people don't want their abilities to abruptly stop working properly based on a relative positioning equation they only have partial control over.

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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 10:32 am 
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Come on i think its pretty easy to imagine numbers for this that work without it swinging "violently". with the right vfx, people could get used to a binary damage setup pretty quickly i think. Not that we'll ever see this in the game at this point.

i realized when snork came out that a big thing i wish his AA had (and all melee characters) was some kind of combo system. interesting AA mechanics give players a lot more to learn & master. as long as we're not talking about street fighter levels of complexity, i'd prefer we keep these things instead of stripping them away. otherwise we slide toward a game where characters feel like they're just some variation of rocco :glasses:


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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:48 pm 
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robochase6000 wrote:
Come on i think its pretty easy to imagine numbers for this that work without it swinging "violently".

Give us some examples of the figures you'd use. It's much easier to judge a concept with actual, objective numbers than it is with various differing interpretations—especially considering this community still doesn't actually agree on what Voltar's supposed to be.

robochase6000 wrote:
i realized when snork came out that a big thing i wish his AA had (and all melee characters) was some kind of combo system. interesting AA mechanics give players a lot more to learn & master.

Interesting mechanics cease to be interesting when everyone has access to them. I also find it ironic that you argue in favour of homogenising 'Naut AAs, but then go on to say...

robochase6000 wrote:
...otherwise we slide toward a game where characters feel like they're just some variation of rocco :glasses:

...as if giving all the roster similar, if not functionally identical, AAs wouldn't make them all variations of a generic, common theme.

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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 3:59 pm 
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Oops I see what you did there. You're right, but I'm not wrong!

I said combo system and meant it kind of loosely in the sense that attacks alternate or somehow change each press. There's a variety of things you can do with timing & damage/effects to crank out interesting things that wouldn't feel homogenous.


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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 10:25 pm 
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robochase6000 wrote:
Oops I see what you did there. You're right, but I'm not wrong!

I said combo system and meant it kind of loosely in the sense that attacks alternate or somehow change each press. There's a variety of things you can do with timing & damage/effects to crank out interesting things that wouldn't feel homogenous.


I can actually see where you're coming from; borrowing some mechanics from 2D fighters and simplifying them could potentially work provided the control set-up was kept simple (something like the system used for the old Naruto 4-man party/fighting games.
Even something as simple as a 'tilt' system a la SSB could work just fine.

That said, this is an idea for Awesomenauts 2, when/if it ever happens, for reasons that should not need explaining.

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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 11:03 pm 
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I'd be perfectly happy to go back to Voltar's "don't press to charge" AA because it was one of the most unique ranged AA's and with some simple number changing it would've been fairly balanced and actually worth charging.

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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 6:37 pm 
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robochase6000 wrote:
i like playing characters that have interesting AA mechanics that require a fair amount of nuance and skill to maximize. Doubly so if they have interesting jumping mechanics.

I dislike characters where i can turn my brain off and tape down the AA button.

But right now you just tape down the AA button and stand further away. :shrug:

The ranged function doesn't add any real dynamicism. It's just a chore.

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 Post subject: Re: An issue with Voltar's AA
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:02 pm 
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Xelrog wrote:
But right now you just tape down the AA button and stand further away. :shrug:


holding down the button is not optimal for any long range AA unless the target is stationary (or if you're zoning, but that's not what we're talking about here). having a piercing upgrade helps - it's more likely you'll hit your intended target with piercing involved if you just want to hold the button down.


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