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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:33 am 
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Thijs wrote:
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Penny Fox
-Fixed that two Energy Pulses with different charge values would cause the amplify damage to stack.

Wow, wonder how you guys caught that one?

Quote:
-Toaster timer nerfed from 3s to 2s per stage

Very good, this upgrade caused a lot of noobstomps and made the ability generally less tactical in its use by letting your presence stick around longer than it should. Maybe mines should detonate X seconds after Yuri dies akin to weedlings? Just a thought.

Quote:
-Aerial spring also increases mine weight/falling speed by 300%

This should be interesting but I'm also worried it'll cause issues with laggy mines. I'm not sure what can be done about that though beyond the matchmaking limiting how often that situation occurs.

Quote:
-Spacetime continuity cost reduced from 200 to 180 solar

To be honest this upgrade could do with a replacement but that's just me. I think Yuri's weakness to CC should remain relevant and BKM (at a lower % ideally) is the main method of lessening that impact without eliminating it.

Quote:
-Regeneration Pod nerfed from healing 50 to 45 per second per stage

Awesome.

We really should replace one of the two slow warp upgrades as 55% is too much and we've weakened a lot of the alternatives that made dual slow undesirable to take while leaving dual slow exactly how it is.

Quote:
-Fixed issue where jetpack would not activate when pressing and holding the up button while falling down through a platform.

Not my useless airwalking trick!

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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:40 am 
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Joost wrote:
Seralla wrote:
Okay, this has been bothering me since their release. Can you guys go ahead and remove Amy from Lux's lore? I say this because she's completely forgotten almost every time, they're either a team in control of the Naut, Lux, or it's just Jimmy. When Ronimo themselves are going with this aswell I fail to see why she's there. ...

We think it's nice and fun that blue team is a girl and red team is a boy. We're not going to remove that.

We also think it's impractical and too long to call them "Jimmy and Amy and the LUX5000" everywhere. We also don't want to alternate between Jimmy and Amy because that would be confusing. Just imagine fun descriptions like "Amy got buffed because Jimmy didn't do enough damage."

That does leave the question: why not make Amy the default name instead of Jimmy? Well, this character was inspired by Lux, the son of Ronimo lead artist Gijs. Since we were basing this character on a real little boy it felt more natural to us to make the boy's name the default name.

Also, note that there's a bunch of devs contributing to these patch notes so we're generally not very consistent in patch notes. Everyone here writes things slightly differently.


I think the awkwardness of the whole ordeal is coming from the fact that the only difference between them is the hat and the bow.

Seriously, I think the whole thing would be fixed if only they had different voice lines. Then they would feel like two actually different characters, instead of nearly identical twins who sound exactly the same. :jimmy:

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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:43 am 
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tolkki wrote:
After playing more LUX I'm glad you're not overbuffing it. Honestly I feel like it's still really close to being too good (I mean a tank that has one of the best escape abilities in the game isn't the most balanced idea).

Even then I'd like to see some small adjustments to how it works:

-Slightly increase the time that you can "save" your combo with your AA (=time it takes before the AA resets back to the first punch). I'm talking about something like 0.3-0.5 seconds here.
Why? Currently it just feels too short. That combined with the fact that it only has two different types of AAs makes the reseting feel more limiting than on say Skolldir.

-Buff Steel boxing gloves (shield on third AA after using an ability) and Fresh sandpit sand (shockwave on AA). Both of them are pretty much garbage.

Steel boxing gloves is either too situational (since it only activates after using an ability) or has too low duration (only two seconds). Mostly both while also just being pretty expensive for something with that low an uptime.

Fresh sandpit sand is really, really finicky on when it wants to activate. You have to both be on the ground when you're starting your AA and when you're ending it, which means you have to stay on the ground for the whole time which makes you a very easy target while wasting your great mobility. Also the damage is awful for something that situational, but if it wasn't as situatinal it might be good enough.
Test how it would work if it would activate even if you're not standing on ground but "close enough" to it (meaning it would activate while doing short hops). That could be enough, maybe?

Edit: Forgot to add the reasoning behind why I think these two upgrades need changes.
Currently your AA row on LUX is pretty much damage, heal and range since the other three upgrades just aren't nearly good enough (attack speed isn't bad but the second stage doesn't work), but on the beta version I'd expect that there's again only three "viable" upgrades (range is still good but the attack speed is probably going to be loads better). Most of LUX's damage comes from the AA so I feel the AA row needs to be especially well balanced to counteract that.

Edit: Edit: Also possibly slightly increase the damage of Micey and the Missile Factory (the "shotgun"-upgrade on missiles). Currently it only increases the damage of missiles overall by 15% (since it decreases the main damage by that much and both of the side missiles do that much) while making it A LOT harder to land all of them (= you pretty much have to be melee range to be even able to hit them on one target). It's a cool upgrade but not really worth it now, try increasing the damage on the side missiles by 5-10% (or possibly experiment with adding another stage to it so it would end up making the side missiles deal 30% of the main missiles damage for 430 solar).


Giving a larger interval seems like a quality-of-life thing until you realize how much better it would make them.
Steel Boxing Gloves just requires that you cancel things out. It's pretty good.
Sandpit Sand bought early makes you a crazy lane-clear machine. It's also excellent against foes in places like Aiguillon bottom, and AI's bot lane where you can cascade damage down.
Agreed that Micey needs something done. When you look at the numbers you're pretty much never helping yourself with it.

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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:52 am 
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GuyBrush wrote:
Thijs wrote:
-Double Glazed Royal Porcelain changed from length reduction to 25% slow for 2 seconds after Chain ends.
-Double Glazed Royal Porcelain price increased from 170 to 185 solar.

This removes a lot of the skill in playing Swiggins, as well as a lot of the counter-play.

This is remotely decent if it doesn't happen when the Anchor is destroyed, or if it only happened when it's destroyed. If this upgrade is just a "Also slow people by whatever for whatever" on top of Anchor's duration, regardless of situation...
There risks a lot of cutting of the skill cap. :sleep:


This is a really good way of putting it. I feel like Swiggins' Anchor Drop is one of the only skills in the entire game that has really good counter-play, that is, it increases the number of choices when using it and when having it used against you. I also agree that new Porcelain is taking away from that counter-play. Here are some alternative suggestions that improve counter-play, rather than decrease it:
  • Adds a minor pull effect centered on the anchor that applies only to the tethered naut. Essentially, this would act as a slow that applies when moving away from the anchor, while allowing them to move toward the anchor more quickly. It makes juking while anchored more interesting.
  • Transfer % of damage applied to the anchor itself to the tethered naut. This adds the question of whether it is better to allow the anchor to time out or destroy it yourself and take some damage.
  • Emits a knockback pulse from the naut that is hit by Anchor Drop.You can't just consider what being tethered does to you anymore. How will it affect your teammates? (Don't remember who came up with this idea, but it's great!)


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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:58 am 
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Stiljoz wrote:
Emits a knockback pulse from the naut that is hit by Anchor Drop.You can't just consider what being tethered does to you anymore. How will it affect your teammates? (Don't remember who came up with this idea, but it's great!)

I don't want to say this is outright my idea but I do remember working with the idea before as a means to add more of a skill ceiling to Swiggins and make anchor drop something that has a significant impact in teamfights. Regardless, I do really like this idea.

But as another porcelain replacement idea, you really could just bring back the old heal on recall since now you can pick and choose your recall timing, which makes a burst heal like that pretty useful.

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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 12:59 am 
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you said you'd buff net if i told you about the bug that makes it almost halfway viable :(
it was the only thing making the upgrade somewhat usable and it's a shame a neat combo mechanic had to be a glitch

edit: can we please buff thief tools and living treasure map


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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:09 am 
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ChrisD wrote:
Giving a larger interval seems like a quality-of-life thing until you realize how much better it would make them.

Yes, which is why I suggested it.

No, I actually don't think it would affect them that much, just make them better to play as.


Steel Boxing Gloves just requires that you cancel things out. It's pretty good.

Even if you cancel things out it's only 2 seconds. Don't think it would be very useful, and besides what upgrade slot would you replace to have it?

Sandpit Sand bought early makes you a crazy lane-clear machine. It's also excellent against foes in places like Aiguillon bottom, and AI's bot lane where you can cascade damage down.

LUX is already good at clearing, and the normal damage increase imo is more than enough. I've never even seen this upgrade used after the first day of the release, and for a good reason.

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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:13 am 
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FishmanDerp wrote:
bring back the old heal on recall since now you can pick and choose your recall timing, which makes a burst heal like that pretty useful.


Oh right. I was going to suggest that as a replacement for Not Seaweed. Either way, I would definitely get that upgrade.


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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:01 am 
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For those of you wondering how stupidly large Yoolip's Pancake Dino is now:
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This stupidly large. :yoolip:

Jesus Christ that thing's the size of Clunk. :GnawShock:

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 Post subject: Re: Patch 3.1 beta 1 is Live!
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:05 am 
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Thijs wrote:
There is no Linux build yet for the beta.


Is there any time estimate on when a Linux build will be available?

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