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 Post subject: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2018 9:40 pm 
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While the Nibbs price changes were a good change for Nibbs, and allowed for her early game to be slightly less terrible I think that some small changes to how she works would help her feel better to play, and wouldn't be too massive in terms of buffs.

After 3 seconds Frenzy now rapidly decays (Losing one stack every .25 seconds) rather then resetting
Since Frenzy lacks any indicator for how long it lasts until it resets I feel that this would help Nibbs players know when they need to hit something, and would make barely missing the 3 second reset (Like hitting something in 3.1 seconds) far less punishing. This is relevant because maintaining Maximum Frenzy stacks is extremely important to 4 different upgrades on Nibbs rows.

Nibbs is now immune to knockback while fire breathing
While Nibbs may seem like she is KB immune atm in actuality she is just simply unable to move from anything during Fire breathe. This change would make cancelling KB with fire breathe and then orbing actually an option because with how it works now using fire breathe on top of a jumppad and then Orbing to cancel fire breathe will result in you being influenced by the jumppad after you orb even though you're supposedly "immune" during fire breathe. This is especially relevant when escaping from Jimmy charges,Lone Bulls, Aqullion Skree cheese

Edit: Since the discussion has moved to this I'm adding it to the list of proposals
MALZ is now on Base
MALZ is an extremely weak upgrade with limited utility, however it has niche usage and synergies that could allow for more flexibility in her row if added to base.This would be a similar case to Jumping dino's being added to base.

These are small changes, but I'd def like to see them alongside the MALZ rework Nibbs is supposed to get in 4.7

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Last edited by Morrowsaw on Fri Jun 08, 2018 2:48 am, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 4:12 pm 
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Ageed on both. The first might be a pseudo buff but the second honestly feels like a quality of life thing above all else.

*Edit on subject of MALZ:
MALZ is a good upgrade... it's just that everything else is objectively 100 times better. The few (read: one) matches where I purchased MALZ it did serve a lot of use to play mind games with my opponent. The problem is that those (one) games I purchased MALZ I was already winning by a landslide and didn't need any other better upgrades. MALZ honestly served more as a safety net there than anything.
What I'm saying is I don't think the upgrade should be on base because it's fairly good in its own right. If it was attached to another upgrade (say, Wormhole, cause people really don't take that upgrade) then it would be worth taking. It's just that a 135 Solar "do nothing" upgrade on a character who's meant to be carrying really sucks.

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Last edited by GuyBrush on Sun Jun 10, 2018 2:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 5:08 pm 
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I don't play Nibbs that much anymore, but I've never had #2 happen to me.
I often buy kb upgrades and never saw this happen to the enemy Nibbs?
Only with release Smiles being able to pull Nibbs in firebreath.
Also do you think you can jump to cancel knockbacks while in firebreath?

I agree on #1 btw, yet I think such a thing should be introduced carefully. She had some mayor buffs recently. Pretty sure most Nibbs already buy Darkenstone since it works with Eternal Flame, while I think you wanted this change to mostly be a buff for AA Nibbs?

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Last edited by Jas123c on Thu Jun 07, 2018 5:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 5:20 pm 
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As an almost exclusively Nibbs player and L1 I disagree with the second suggestion. Small nuances like that is what makes nauts. It's an unnecessary change that takes away utility and changes how Nibbs moves for no apparent gain.

I wouldn't mind the first suggestion, as it would make her a bit more lenient for beginners and make the different frenzy stages a bit more noticeable when it comes to attackspeed/dmg.

Also any place I can read about Malz rework?


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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 6:55 pm 
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What the hell is a MALZ?

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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 7:20 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 7:41 pm 
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Arti wrote:
As an almost exclusively Nibbs player and L1 I disagree with the second suggestion. Small nuances like that is what makes nauts. It's an unnecessary change that takes away utility and changes how Nibbs moves for no apparent gain.

Umm I'm one of those as well. Regardless it does have quite the impact on how she moves in certain situations however with constant ticking knockback like dash/charge or jumppads I believe it's important that she isn't impacted this way because in certain situations it can screw her over. Because as of now she's impacted like this gif shows

Image

Arti wrote:
Also any place I can read about Malz rework?

While it was never fully decided what MALZ would become this is what Jasper said on the topic (Monkey Hand and MALZ replacement thread is still on the front page of the balance forum btw)

Jasper wrote:
When it comes to MALZ here are some of the ideas I saw and like so far
-Heal after teleport
-Knockback pulse before teleport (would allow some tricky plays where you knock enemies towards where you teleport, suck em closer then firebruh)
-Pulses or trails which speed up allies


As for the discussion on Eternal Flame, and all that. She's had no real major buffs recently the only one is Eternal Flame which is bugged and shoots out fireballs instantly instead of taking about .5 seconds to start shooting them. The intention was to make these upgrades more powerful including Darkenstone which right now is alot easier to use thanks to Eternal Flame taking less time to use

Jas123 wrote:
I think you wanted this change to mostly be a buff for AA Nibbs?

I mean it was for no build in general since Nibbs has her AA row set as a utility row for the most part and 3 of the upgrades in that row alone make use of max frenzy specifically. Also I don't believe you can jump during fire breathe.

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Last edited by Morrowsaw on Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:17 pm 
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Morrowsaw wrote:
Arti wrote:
As an almost exclusively Nibbs player and L1 I disagree with the second suggestion. Small nuances like that is what makes nauts. It's an unnecessary change that takes away utility and changes how Nibbs moves for no apparent gain.

Umm I'm one of those as well. Regardless it does have quite the impact on how she moves in certain situations however with constant ticking knockback like dash/charge or jumppads I believe it's important that she isn't impacted this way because in certain situations it can screw her over. Because as of now she's impacted like this gif shows

https://gfycat.com/NaughtyShabbyIntermediateegret


Yeah I agree that it has quite the impact on how she moves, and I think that's why it shouldn't be messed with. Your example is one that doesn't take advantage of her unique movement. If you had counted on the momentum you could have placed the sphere under coco and got a few aa hits on her while having the option to cancel the momentum with your second jump if you don't want to fly into mid. Also if coco gets scared and goes under the worm, not counting on your momentum, you cancel momentum over worm and eat her.

Not to forget that it's possible to teleport to the orb at any point during firebreath, you control when you fly. It's great utility, why do you want to take it away?

Morrowsaw wrote:
While it was never fully decided what MALZ would become this is what Jasper said on the topic (Monkey Hand and MALZ replacement thread is still on the front page of the balance forum btw)

Jasper wrote:
When it comes to MALZ here are some of the ideas I saw and like so far
-Heal after teleport
-Knockback pulse before teleport (would allow some tricky plays where you knock enemies towards where you teleport, suck em closer then firebruh)
-Pulses or trails which speed up allies


As for the discussion on Eternal Flame, and all that. She's had no real major buffs recently the only one is Eternal Flame which is bugged and shoots out fireballs instantly instead of taking about .5 seconds to start shooting them. The intention was to make these upgrades more powerful including Darkenstone which right now is alot easier to use thanks to Eternal Flame taking less time to use

Jas123 wrote:
I think you wanted this change to mostly be a buff for AA Nibbs?

I mean it was for no build in general since Nibbs has her AA row set as a utility row for the most part and 3 of the upgrades in that row alone make use of max frenzy specifically. Also I don't believe you can jump during fire breathe.


Oh didn't even know that upgrades name so I read up on the discussion now. Don't know what I want to replace it, but it's clearly a crap upgrade. They should give it to Nibbs as a default like they did with dinojump for yoolip, it wouldn't change much because it's not actually useful unlike dinojump but it's kinda fun in brawls. Not worth a slot though.

2-3 sec blind on orb would be kinda fun though.


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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:59 pm 
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bring back aa nibbs


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 Post subject: Re: Small changes I'd like to see to Nibbs in 4.7
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:43 pm 
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I'm not removing any elements of her movement. Or at least any that I can think of. I just want her to no longer be effected by knockback ticks the way she currently since it can sometimes prevent you from cancelling knockback with fire breathe. To better explain what I want fixed I made some examples with my friend just to show off my main issue. It's less that these are huge issues to her matchups, and more that it makes dealing with these sorts of situations alot harder then they'd need to be.

Image
Image
Image

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